My Dear LDS Friends,

This post covers key points of a conversation with a Mormon Stake President and his Councilor. Audio of the entire event, with timeline notes, is presented below. Short background videos and key excerpts from the conversation, with explanatory comments, are also provided.

I encourage you to look through the timeline notes and defend the position of these Mormon leaders, if you can. If you are unable, I sincerely invite future discussion, publicly or privately, as you desire.

Jesus is my Rock. He is the Rock upon which I build a spiritual home, to which I cling and the sure mooring where I anchor my soul. He is the Rock of my faith, hope and every assurance. Jesus is my Christ. Rock is the first name of the stake president, he is the lower case rock.

Introduction

See full audio and timeline questions below.

The Truth

See full audio and timeline questions below.

PNG Letter Destroys Family Unity

During the 2016 Mormon Excommunication of myself, Lance Earl, a 911 call was placed, and a false police report was filed. This single event evolved into the creation of a PNG (Persona Non-Grata) letter, which claimed I had become a threat to the safety of Mormon leaders and the church membership.

It seems reasonable that the 911 call would have been made at the moment I presented the greatest danger. Thankfully, the hearing was being recorded without the knowledge of the Mormon authorities. At 1:07 in the following video, you will hear Stake President Garn Lovell place the 911 call and request police assistance. As that call goes out, ask yourself, where is the threat?

Gag Order

See full audio and timeline questions below.

Joseph Smith

See full audio and timeline questions below.

Full Audio and Timeline Questions

Timeline Notes

• 0:50 I presented an audio recorder so all would know the meeting was being recorded.
• 1:43 Every discussion with the Stake President has focused on the nature of God, the Gospel, how men may be reconciled with God and testing for false gods, gospels and doctrines.
  • Question: Can any of these foundational topics be considered minor contextual conversations?
• 02:15 All participants agreed to place truth above all else and make individual beliefs secondary.
• 03:15 Stake President claims to have a desire to remove the PNG (Persona Non Grata) letter.
  • Question: Since the Stake President admitted that I have met the requirement to have the PNG letter removed, does he have an obligation to honor the terms set forth therein?
• 03:53 Stake President claims that he does not lie.
  • Question: Does contrasting the Stake President’s statement with James 2:10 prove the Stake President to be a liar and more?
• 04:28 The Mormon church has compiled a file of “evidence of violence and/or violent intentions” by which they justified the PNG letter. I have never been allowed to know what the accusations against me are.
  • Question: The church has punished me and my Mother for years on the basis of unknown accusations. Do I have a right to know and respond to the accusations against me?
• 07:25 Stake President claims to be making decisions based on what happened with me in the past. Yet, he refused to hear audio of what I was doing and saying when the 911 call was placed, and police summoned me to my excommunication hearing.
  • Question: As a Stake President (Judge in Israel), does he have an obligation to understand the facts before taking punitive action against an individual?
• 08:00 The Stake President claims that people complain all the time about me proselyting in the community.
  • Question: At 27:20, the Stake President indicated there had been one, maybe two, complaints. Do these contradictory claims disprove the Stake President’s claim that he does not lie, as heard at 3:53?
• 08:22 Stake President affirms that I have honored the restrictions outlined in the PNG letter.
  • Question: Having met the stated requirements for PNG letter removal, does the Stake President have an obligation to honor the conditions of that letter?
• 08:56 The Stake President accused me of denouncing former Bishop Ralphs and Stake President Garn Lovell.
  • Question: Since my teachings only focus on the gospel of Jesus and never address the actions of former church leaders, how can we believe the Stake President’s claim of honesty found at 03:53?
• 14:33 I charged the Mormon church with denying the racist doctrine that existed from its inception until 1978.
  • Question: Acts 10:34 and Galatians 3:28 teach us that all people are seen equally by God. From the church’s inception until 1978, did it deny the Word of God?
• 17:46 Mormon church is accused of lying to cover its own sins.
  • Question: Jeffrey R. Holland said LDS restrictions on race are “folklore” that must never be perpetuated: “However well-intended the explanations were, I think almost all of them were inadequate and/or wrong. … We simply do not know why that practice … was in place.” By this statement, did Jeffrey R. Holland deny the prophetic words of almost every prophet and apostle prior to 1978?
• 18:18 Stake President attempts to de-emphasize official doctrine.
  • Question: When is official doctrine not doctrinal?
• 19:26 Bruce McConkie refutes all Mormon teachings prior to 1978 relative to black people and priesthood/temple blessings, “It doesn’t make a particle of difference what anybody ever said about the Negro matter before the first day of June of this year, 1978. It is a new day and a new arrangement …”
  • Question: How does this not attempt to negate 120 years of Mormon theology?
• 20:02 Stake President attempts to justify Mormon false doctrine by suggesting the same corruption exists in the Bible.
  • Question: How are the Stake President’s words not a denial of 2 Timothy 3:16 and 2 Peter 1:21?
• 21:13 Bruce McConkie denied the prophetic role of Brigham Young. In a letter to BYU professor Eugene England, McConkie indicated that Brigham Young’, “expressed views that are out of harmony with the gospel” [and] “erred in some of his statements on the nature and kind of being that God is. . . . What [Brigham Young] did is not a pattern for any of us. If we choose to believe and teach the false portions of his doctrines, we are making an election that will damn us.”
  • Question: Can a true prophet of God teach doctrine that will damn us?
• 21:45 The church lies about the relationship between Joseph and Emma Smith. In the October, 1866 General Conference , Brigham told of a conversation between Joseph and Emma, “Not six months before the death of Joseph, he called his wife Emma into a secret council . . . He told her of the time she undertook to poison him, and he told her that she was a child of hell, and literally the most wicked woman on this earth, that there was not one more wicked than she.“
  • Question: Since the church hides the truth about Joseph and Emma, what other essential truths have been hidden?
• 22:35 Stake President classifies my points as “garbage”.
  • Question: Having failed to factually refute any of the points in question, is the Stake President genuinely seeking truth, as affirmed at 02:15?
• 23:56 Stake President confirms and denies that the Bible contains the fullness of the Everlasting Gospel. The Book of Mormon makes the same affirmation and denial. One of these claims may be true, but both cannot be simultaneously true. By these, Mormonism denies Isaiah 40:8, Matthew 16:18, Matthew 24:35, Mark 13:31 and Luke 21:33.
  • Question: By both affirming and denying that the Bible contains the fullness of the Gospel, do the Stake President’s actions deny his claim of always speaking truth at 03:53?
• 24:36 The Stake President claims to have no problem with the Book of Mormon affirming and denying points of doctrine as he did at 23:56.
  • Question: Is the Stake President denying Hebrews 13:8 by this action?
• 27:20 Speaking of the frequency in which people complain about my local proselyting, the Stake President said, “We’re talking like very few, like one or two. “
  • Question: At 08:00, the Stake President claimed that people complain about me “all the time,” and now he claims something different. Can both of these statements be true?
  • Question: Considering the above question, can anyone believe the Stake President’s claim about speaking the truth at 03:53?
• 29:35 The Stake President falsely accuses me of saying derogatory things about his stability in boots. The accusation was repeated at 30:30.
  • Question: This statement is a blatant lie. How does this not refute his previous claim of integrity at 03:53 and cast doubt on his other truth claims?
• 38:46 Stake President justifies a woman who says she keeps all the commandments.
  • Question: Do his words show contempt for 1 John 1:8 & 10, Romans 3:10-18, Philippians 3:8, and Isaiah 64:6?
• 42:08 I accused the Mormon church of ignoring Peter for 2000 years. See John 2:17,18; see also Galatians 3:28 and Acts 10:34.
• 43:41 Stake President justifies a Mormon High Priest who adds words to holy scripture that fundamentally change the nature of God.
  • Question: How is this man not condemned by Deuteronomy 13:1-5, Isaiah 43:10, Isaiah 44:6, Acts 17:11, Galatians 1:6-9, and Revelation 2:2?
• 43:51 The stake President considers it wonderful and loves the man who makes up his own scriptural truth according to man-made ideas.
  • Question: In this, does he deny Proverbs 14:12?
• 44:53 Mormonism denies Jesus’ own words about the majority of people who choose the broad way that leads to destruction. See Matthew 7:13 and Revelation 21:8.
  • Question: Can this Stake President be a follower of Jesus while boldly rejecting His word?
• 48:46 Stake President interjects Doctrine and Covenants 8 & 9 into the conversation and claims they are equivalent to Jeremiah 17:9 when in fact, they are exact opposites.
  • How can two opposite doctrines be of God?
• 49:45 Joseph Smith fails the Deuteronomy 18:20-22 test of a prophet.
  • Question: Joseph Smith prophesied the time when Jesus would return. That prophesy failed. By this prophecy, is Smith proven a false prophet, and did he deny Matthew 24:32 & Mark 13:32?
  • Question: Joseph Smith prophesied of the building of a temple in Missouri. The time of completion has passed. Is Smith proven to be a false prophet?
• 50:52 Mormon doctrine confirms that Jesus and Joseph Smith are equally the way the truth and the life. Brigham Young taught, “From the day that the Priesthood was taken from the earth to the winding-up scene of all things, every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are.“(Journal of Discourses vol 7 p 289)
  • Question: Can anyone believe this without denying what Jesus said of Himself in John 14:6?
• 53:47 Councilor to the Stake President denied the very words of Joseph Smith, “I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet.” (History of the Church, vol 6 pp 408-409)
  • Question: Can this counselor in the Stake Presidency rightly lead the Mormon people while denying the history of his own church?
• 54:40 The Councilor to the Stake Presidency claimed that Joseph Smith didn’t do anything wrong in his life. If this is true, Joseph Smith and Jesus Christ must be considered equal in their perfection.
  • Question: By this statement, is 1 John 1:8,10 denied?
  • Question: By this statement, did this man elevate Joseph Smith to the level of Jesus, and is that blasphemy?
• 55:15 Only moments after testifying that Joseph Smith didn’t do anything wrong in everything he did, he was faced with the question of Smith consuming alcohol on the day he died. The Counselor was unable to confirm or deny that the consumption of alcohol is wrong in Mormonism.
  • Question: Can this Counselor truly know Smith never did anything wrong while simultaneously being unable to affirm or deny that Smith did wrong when he consumed alcohol?
• 57:52 The Stake President accused me of violating the law. The church brought criminal charges against me, which were heard in a court of law and dismissed.
  • Question: Is it dishonest of the Stake President to make such an accusation when the matter has been heard and dismissed?
• 1:00:03 Finally, we get to the heart of the matter. The Stake President affirmed that I received a gag order in 2015, and that the former stake president tried to block me from speaking during my excommunication hearing. He then demanded that I no longer speak of Joseph Smith or the holes in Mormon doctrine as a for removal of the PNG letter. Peter and John received the same gag order in Acts 4:18 and Acts 5:40. I assure you that my answer is and will always be united with Peter and John as recorded in Acts 4:19-20 and Acts 5:29.
  • Question: How is this Stake President not in a class equal to the Jewish leaders whom Jesus called vipers and Peter and John defied?
• 1:00:05 The Stake President demands that I no longer speak to him about Joseph Smith or the holes in Mormon doctrine and speak only of Jesus in the future. Yes, by all means, let us talk of Jesus:

The Challenge

Two promises are at work here. The first is delivered through the Mormon prophet Joseph Smith. The second is presented in the gospel of Luke and are the actual words of Jesus Christ.

Wherefore, confound your enemies; call upon them to meet you both in public and in private; and inasmuch as ye are faithful their shame shall be made manifest.

Doctrine & Covenants 71:7

Settle it therefore in your hearts, not to meditate before what ye shall answer: For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.

Luke 21:14-15